New subject: Profile for Heatset Woodfree Uncoated

1 Jun 2011

      Hi Jan-Peter

I agree with your thoughts on these two profiles.

In using both I find that the papers in the market, wood free uncoated and
SC are much whiter than the white point of the profiles, due to OBA's,
because this is what the end user likes.

So often I am making a profile amendment to change the white paper point,
when using these profiles.

Regards

Paul Sherfield

The Missing Horse Consultancy Ltd

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 Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 23:49:50 +0200
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 Today's Topics:

    1. Profile for Heatset Woodfree Uncoated (Jan-Peter Homann)
    2. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    3. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    4. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    5. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    6. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    7. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    8. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
    9. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
   10. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
   11. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)
   12. Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office (stoll(a)orellkarto.ch)

 ----------------------------------------------------------------------

 Message: 1
 Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:32:25 +0200
 From: Jan-Peter Homann &lt;homann(a)colormanagement.de&gt;
 Subject: [ECI-EN] Profile for Heatset Woodfree Uncoated
 To: Printing Across Borders &lt;pab(a)lists.callassoftware.com&gt;om>,
 eci-en(a)lists.callassoftware.com
 Message-ID: &lt;4DE55059.6080904(a)colormanagement.de&gt;
 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed

 Hello all together,
 I?m currently discussing with a paper manufacturer recommendations for
 FOGRA char-data / ECI-profiles for his papers.

 For woodfree uncoated papers, it seems clear, that FOGRA 47 /
 PSO_uncoated_eci.icc should be used.

 But digging a little bit deeper into paper categorization and printing
 standards, the situation is not so clear.
 If we look at the gamut, FOGRA47 /PSO_uncoated is smaller than e.g.
 FOGRA40 / sc-paper.

 If we are looking at the the traditional paper categorization for
 heatset printing, the WFU (Wood free uncoated) papers are representing a
 higher quality grade than SC papers (both are uncoated materials, but
 SC-papers have a higher amount of wood fibers than wood free papers...)

 So far as I learned about traditional paper categorization, the WFU
 papers can may be super calandered or not. If not, this are the typical
 uncoated papers, which are used e.g. in sheetfeed offset printing with
 data preparation according FOGRA47 / PSO_uncoated.
 If they are super calandered (WFU SC), they are more comparable with the
 SC-paper category but with a much brighter paperwhite.

 *****************
 L*a*b* 100 K an 100C 100M 100Y for FOGRA 47 and FOGRA40
 *****************
 Source: MedienStandard Druck 2010 from bvdm

 FOGRA 47 Black Backing
 100 K = L*31 a*1 b*1
 100C 100M 100Y = L*32 a*0 b*0

 FOGRA 47 White Backing
 100 K = L*31 a*1 b*1
 100C 100M 100Y = L*33 a*0 b*0

 FOGRA 40 Black Backing
 100 K = L*22.2 a*0,9 b*2,1
 100C 100M 100Y = L*26,2 a*-1,6 b*-3

 FOGRA 40 White Backing
 100 K = L*22.4 a*1,1 b*2,3
 100C 100M 100Y = L*26,6 a*-1,5 b*-2,8

 The comparison of this values, shows, that the densities / amount of
 color for FOGRA 47 (uncoated) is much lower than for FOGRA40 (SC-paper).

 Especially for WFU SC, this leads to following question:
 - If ISO 12647-2 papertype 4 is used as standardization target and FOGRA
 47 / PSO_uncoated for data preparation, we have a quite small gamut
 compared to FOGRA 40 / SCpaper.
 On the other hand FOGRA 40 / SCpaper could not used as target, because
 the whitepoint of WFU SC is very different to FOGRA 40 / SCpaper. A
 better candidate for gamut and paperwhite could be theoretically FOGRA41
 / PSO_MFC. But technically , this profile represents another paper category.

 Another possibility would be, that the paper manufacturer adapts the
 available standardization targets, publishes target values for white and
 black backing and makes characterization-data and an ICC-profile public
 available. For PDF/X workflows the characterization-data would be
 registered at http://www.color.org

 I would be interested to hear what other people are thinking about this
 issue

 Best regards
 Jan-Peter

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 Jan-Peter Homann ------------ mobile +49 171 54 70 358
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 ------------------------------

 Message: 2
 Date: Tue, 31 May 2011 22:36:00 +0200 (CEST)
 From: stoll(a)orellkarto.ch
 Subject: [ECI-EN] Abwesenheitsnotiz / Out of office
 To: eci-en(a)lists.callassoftware.com, homann(a)colormanagement.de
 Message-ID: &lt;20110531203600.04E9BD045102(a)lists.callassoftware.com&gt;

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