5:30 p.m.
At 11:14 12-12-2005 +0100, Guenter Bestmann wrote:
Hello,
To get a first impression on certification in Germany please look to the
fogra website
and then to "certications" and "Process stand."
Organizations like fogra or bvdm offer services to get a certification.
It is not a one time task, printers who are certified had to repeat the
process every year.
Kind regards,
Guenter
Hi Guenter,
The existing document of Fogra mentions that the certification is valid for
two years.
Regards,
Henk Gianotten
Received: from mail2.feburman.co.uk (83-244-143-164.cust-83.exponential-e.net
[83.244.143.164])
by lists.transmedia.de (8.9.3/8.9.3/SuSE Linux 8.9.3-0.1) with ESMTP id PAA14048
for <eci-en(a)lists.transmedia.de>de>; Mon, 12 Dec 2005 15:36:18 +0100
Received: from [10.0.1.2] (spc1-norw3-4-0-cust124.asfd.broadband.ntl.com
[81.108.129.124])
by mail2.feburman.co.uk (SGI-8.12.5/8.12.5) with ESMTP id jBCEl1DT8327675;
Mon, 12 Dec 2005 14:47:01 GMT
Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v746.2)
In-Reply-To: <A8F2DD0E-926F-4BD1-B2BB-8CEF03B197FA(a)metadesign.de>
References:
<OF5ADD07FB.D45BB362-ON862570CB.0042E0C1-862570CB.00433791(a)vertisinc.com>
<A8F2DD0E-926F-4BD1-B2BB-8CEF03B197FA(a)metadesign.de>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; delsp=yes; format=flowed
Message-Id: <B1F4D827-1C71-44E9-BEC0-946133DB56BB(a)feburman.co.uk>
From: Andy Psarianos <andy(a)feburman.co.uk>
Date: Mon, 12 Dec 2005 14:36:26 +0000
To: Printing Across Borders <pab(a)lists.callassoftware.com>om>,
eci-en(a)lists.transmedia.de, wowg(a)lists.callassoftware.com
X-Mailer: Apple Mail (2.746.2)
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by lists.transmedia.de id PAA14048
Subject: [ECI-EN] Re: [pab] Re: Standard profiles for print, based on FOGRA data
Sender: eci-en-admin(a)lists.transmedia.de
Errors-To: eci-en-admin(a)lists.transmedia.de
X-BeenThere: eci-en(a)lists.transmedia.de
X-Mailman-Version: 2.0beta2
Precedence: bulk
Reply-To: eci-en(a)lists.transmedia.de
List-Id: European Color Initiative mailing list (English language)
<eci-en.lists.transmedia.de>
Dear all,
First off I thank you all for your very useful responses to this post.
The PPA supports and will continue to support international best
practices.
Therefore we believe that the current position of the PPA and the
release of the PPA profile, must be clarified.
A few relevant facts.
a) proof4press is currently the PROOFING colour space in the UK
magazine market.
b) It works on a VISUAL basis.
c) It has been around for a long time. (before the current ISO specs)
d) UK printers and repro houses have worked to these proofs and
proofing specs for a long time, are both comfortable and confident in
them.
What the new profile intends to achieve
a) The profile to be released describes this PROOFING colour space,
and the measurement data has been created from a proof
b) It is being released as a temporary fix for a real-world problem
Step forward.
We recognise that the PPA needs to move it's proofing specifications
to be more in line with internationally accepted printing standards,
but it must be acknowledged that due to the overwhelming success of
proof4press this is not easy. The current ISO specifications are not
a VISUAL specification, they are a process control standard and do
not explicitly describe what things look like!
We know that we have much work to do and it is for this reason that
we intend to invite several industry experts to help the PPA's
pass4press committee address these issues over the coming year.
Andy Psarianos,
on behalf the PPA's pass4press committee
On 5 Dec 2005, at 20:35, Florian S��l wrote:
Dear Andy,
Dear Steve and all,
I totally agree with Steve's recommendation to wait until the
availability of the revised ISO aim values. Based on these values
we will get new characterization data (FOGRA39 following) and based
on these characterization data ECI will provide new Offset profiles
(version 2).
As many printers reported problems with too high total ink
coverage, the new profiles definitely will be created with lower
TIC settings.
According to today's schedule the new characterization data and
profiles should be available in about 6 month from now.
Florian,
for ECI (responsible for the ECI Offset profiles)
Am 02.12.2005 um 13:14 schrieb Steve Smiley:
Howdy,
By this note I am not endorsing the use of the ECI profiles.
Before we jump into non- ISO standards, which I think will not be a
unifying solution. Shouldn't we wait until the
new FOGRA data sets are available with the correct RGB overprints,
these
are in the currently in the works.
FOGRA 39 - I believe will be replacing FOGRAS27.
Steve
Steve Smiley | Director of Color Engineering | VERTIS | 2010
Westridge |
Irving, TX 75038
T 972.373.4805 | F 373.714.4800 | C 214.263.9919 |
ssmiley(a)vertisinc.com |
http://vertisinc.com
Vertis is the premier provider of targeted advertising, media, and
marketing services that drive consumers to marketers more
effectively.
"Henk Gianotten"
<henk(a)gianotten.c
om> To
"Printing Across Borders"
12/01/2005 08:15 <pab(a)lists.callassoftware.com>
PM cc
"Debrah Read"
<Debrah_Read(a)ipcmedia.com>om>,
<list_sc_color_management@ghentpdfw
orkgroup.org>,
<jonathan.moore(a)condenast.co.uk>uk>,
<kristoff.decroix(a)roularta.be>be>,
<wowg(a)lists.callassoftware.com>
Subject
Standard profiles for
print, based
on Fogra data
At 17:08 1-12-2005 +0000, Paul wrote:
--
Florian Suessl, Director Technology
MetaDesign AG, Leibnizstrasse 65, 10629 Berlin
+49 30 59 00 54 246, fax +49 30 59 00 54 114
fsuessl(a)metadesign.de, http://www.metadesign.de, www.metaprintcheck.de
_______________________________________________
pab mailing list
pab(a)lists.callassoftware.com
http://lists.callassoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/pab Hi all
(snip)
Elies suggest of using one of the ISO/FOGRA data sets, these are
feely
available, and making one from these data sets for the UK
magazine market
is
sound, and would help in unifying standards, both
on press and for
proofing.
This could be released as an FOGRA/PPA CMYK profile, and say
based on
dataset 27 would make the 'Proof for Press' standard much easier to
implement and control, and widen the range possible suppliers.
Now may be the best time for the PPA to reflect and change
direction a
little (to ISO) with the 'Proof for Press' standard?
Regards
Paul Sherfield
Hi,
I agree with the opinions of Elie, Paul and Robert.
Adobe too, wanted to create different profiles for inclusion in
Creative
Suite and Acrobat.
They took the Fogra characterization data sets and created new
profiles
with a shorter black
for the printers and designers who don't (yet) want to use heavy
GCR and
long black plates.
And not only profiles based on Fogra 27 and 30.
Even the profiles based on Fogra 28 and 29 data are in preparation.
Adobe took the right steps and did not use non-standardized
characterization data.
In their opinion the existing Fogra data sets are fine.
Of course some printing companies use profiles different from
ECI's and
Adobes ISOcoated.
But as long as they use the right starting point, they can
modify what they want and create the plates their operators prefer.
The suppliers of digital files and proofs have to use tools based
on the
same characterization data.
That's, in my opinion, the best solution to optimize your work flow.
As soon as your systems are able to deliver "printable" proofs
(Fogra27,
28, 29, 30) you can slowly change your
color separation criteria and modify the profiles.
Based on the kind of images you reproduce.
Based on the stability of your printing process, you can introduce
the other profiles to separate more black and less color.
And use the sophisticated tools to reduce your TAC.
The result? A better process, a more stable process and less costs
for ink.
Which is (nowadays) more important than ever.
Regards,
Henk Gianotten
_______________________________________________
pab mailing list
pab(a)lists.callassoftware.com
http://lists.callassoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/pab